Konono Limits: Vampire Weekend’s Chris Baio and Kinshasa’s Konono No.1 in Conversation

One of the great myths of Western music is that it is made out of difficult situations, tough living, grit and grind: the lone country or folk troubadour wandering his lonely road, the nihilistic anger of punk, the beans on toast and charity shop clothes of indie. All of this pales into decadence compared to the challenges faced by Konono No 1, the Congolese group who, unable to afford instruments, for four decades have trawled the scrapyards of Kinshasha to find bits of wreckage with which to make music. Like an African Einsturzende Neubauten, they create both junkyard versions of more traditional instruments and creations that are entirely their own, parts of defunct vehicles and machines that power the endless grooves and rippling rhythmic patterns of their songs.

In recent years, labels like Crammed Discs have begun to collect this material on a series of well-regarded Congotronics compilations, culminating in the release of a new studio album, Assume Crash Position, last year. Their open-ended, welcoming music has led to a dialogue with the West too, with artists including Animal Collective, Deerhoof and Shackleton joining on the Tradi-Mods Vs. Rockers compilation. It’s only fitting, then, that we have Chris Baio (who DJs at Field Day this year) of Vampire Weekend (a band shaped by African sounds) interview Konono No.1 about their incredible tale. And come Field Day, who knows what metallic treasures the group might unearth in East London’s scrapyards.

BAIO: I’ve read that Mawangu Mingiedi started Konono No. 1 in Kinshasa “as early as 1949 and as late as 1966” – around what year was the first version of the group formed?

KONONO: Mingiedi started his first band in 1949 playing with likembes made of bambou. In 1966 he found a way to electrify them which gave birth to his Konono No1.

BAIO: In The Wire story on Konono No. 1 it said that the group’s name comes from the Kikongo word Kukonana, which means to become sad or stiff, like when it’s cold out and you don’t have a sweater. When I listen to your music, though, I hear a lot of warmth and positivity. I was wondering, do you ever feel Kukonana through the challenges of writing, recording and performing your works?

KONONO: “Kukonana” is a word that describes the stiffness of dead bodies. The name was chosen as the band played at a lot of mourning ceremonies. Congolese mourning ceremonies have a cathartic element, they celebrate life to ease the pain of the family of the deceased, people dance and are joyful.

BAIO: A lot of the originality in your sound comes from the thumb piano called the Likembe, which Mingiedi would amplify with magnets found in car alternators & wires found in bins starting in the 60’s. How long does it take you to build these special Likembes? Could you describe the process a little? How many do you think you’ve built in your life?

KONONO: It may take more than a month. First, one has to find a very hard but rare type of wood, carve out space for the microphone and the cables. One has to find pieces of metal for the blades and the bridge, bend them into the right shape and size and along with a few magnets fit them to the body. Finally one needs to reel/wire the microphone (more than one thousand wirings), tune the blades, flush out and get rid of any unwanted noise. All of this is done by hand which as you can imagine takes a lot of time. [Augustine answers] My father Mingiedi has made them for as long as I can remember, I don’t know how many he has made and am pretty sure he has never counted them.

BAIO: You’ve been playing your style of Bazombo Trance music since at least the 1960’s, and yet after the release of Congotronics in 2004 you were hailed as innovative and even won the Newcomer award at the BBC Awards for World Music. What was that experience like for you? Did you imagine that as a possibility at any earlier points in your life of playing music?

KONONO: We were not exactly new on the scene, however it did seem to represent a new departure. At the time, the group was in a difficult situation, my father felt discouraged when the master records of the two 45 tour LPs were lost that had made our name. In addition, the economic situation grew even tougher, no sponsors, no producers or help whatsoever.

BAIO: When Congotronics came out, your sound was compared a lot to that of the Velvet Underground. At the time you said you hadn’t heard their music. Have you heard it since? What do you make of it?

KONONO: No.

BAIO: Your music is also often compared to electronic music. When The Guardian interviewed you in 2006 you said you didn’t even know of electronic music a few years before. I recently came across Mark Ernestus’ awesome remix of your track, “Masikulu Dub.” How does it feel to have other musicians reinterpret your work? Do you enjoy it? Are you interested in doing more work with electronic musicians in the future?

KONONO: This version surprised us, initially we did not recognize the original. Not only are we very pleased to hear that our music is appreciated, but also that is now being explored in this way. We never worked with electronic artists, but we have the impression that they are much more at ease with computers than with ‘real’ musicians.

BAIO: You’ve collaborated with other artists recently, like Bjork, Herbie Hancock and the Belgian rapper Baloji. What challenges have you faced in these collaborations? Are there other musicians you want to work with?

KONONO: What I said about electronic artists, obviously does not apply to Bjork or Herbie Hancock, there is real interaction in real time. It is a shame that those encounters only last for one studio session…in this respect the work we are currently doing with Congotronics vs Rockers (Deerhoof, Skeletons, Juana Molina, etc) allows us to work with more depth. It is often said that music is a universal language, but it is there that we became really conscious of that for the first time.

BAIO: One thing that’s very special about your group is that its signature instrument and sound is being passed down through the generations – Mingiedi has taught the Likembe to his son Augustin, who plays in the group, who has taught it to his children who may some day be part of the group. Can you imagine Konono No. 1 touring the world 50 years from now?

KONONO: Why not, I taught my son Makonda to play the likembe. He plays very well and in the next 50 years he will not have reached the age of Mingiedi yet!

BAIO: When I’ve spent months on the road with Vampire Weekend and our crew, I’ve felt
like a special bond gets formed not unlike that of a real family. There’s this idea of all being in something together. I can only imagine what it’s like to go on tour with your real family. Can you think of any examples on tour where you’ve been happy to have your family by your side? Any time where you wish your family wasn’t there?

KONONO: Families always have conflicts, and surely they do not suddenly stop when we go on tour. But we know and trust each other, and problems tend to be resolved fairly quickly.

BAIO: Before the mid-2000s, Mingiedi had never left Africa. For the past six years or so you’ve traveled the world touring. Where are your favourite places to travel? Where are your favourite places to perform?

KONONO: We were surprised to find that we were paid less in the US than in Europe. We hoped that it would be the opposite since the US is considered the richest country in the world. Yet it is there that we prefer to play because the audience is particularly warm and receptive. I find that the Americans are better dancers than Europeans. They also buy many more T-shirts and posters. We much like to play in Japan also. The Japanese are inquisitive, their questions show that they know our music really well.

BAIO: When you perform in Kinshasa, it’s typically an all-night affair. In Europe and America where there are curfews and strict festival slots, you play for a much shorter period of time. Do you feel like you’re able to communicate everything you want for the Konono live experience in an hour-long time slot? Do you wish you could play for longer at these places?

KONONO: The concerts in Kinshasa start at around 18:00 and last until the morning. But we do not play non stop: every two hours or so we take a break of one hour. But in the morning we are tired, not so much from playing as from standing all night. It is safe to say that our music is different when we play it for two hours or more but in the end we learned to manage our energy in such a way that we give our utmost even during very short performances, on TV for instance.

BAIO: In The Wire feature, your hype-man Menga described music as “a medicine” and typically your lyrics have some kind of social message and advice. Do you feel like touring the world has given you new wisdom you want to impart on your listeners?

KONONO: We do not pretend to communicate any wisdom, sharing pleasure and our love of life already is a lot.

BAIO: I imagine most of the people reading this have never been to Kinshasa. Can you describe it? What’s your neighborhood like? What do you do in your free time when you’re not playing music?

KONONO: Kinshasa is an enormous city (estimated 8 million inhabitants) and very spread out (most houses only have a ground floor). Transport is incredibly slow and very chaotic, most taxis are very old and constantly break down, the traffic jams are permanent. When you, like us, live in a remote suburb at 30 km from the centre of town, it may take you half a day to get there. We live in Kimbanseke which has enormous problems with running water or electricity. Often we arrive home after having sat in a traffic jam for two hours to find that we can not cook. Life is very tough there, but no ‘Kinois’ would choose to live elsewhere.

BAIO: Which Kinshasa musicians do you enjoy?

KONONO: We like other ‘tradi-moderne’ orchestras like Kasai Allstars, Le Folklore Bantandu. Other modern musicians whose work we appreciate are Zaiko Langa Langa and Werrason.

BAIO: Anytime I meet someone from another place, I ask them about their favourite movies made in their country. Right now in New York a movie that takes place in Kinshasa, called Viva Riva!, is playing. It looks great and I plan on seeing it in the next couple days. What are your favourite movies made in the Congo?

KONONO: There have been no cinemas in Kinshasa for a very long time, and Congolese films are few and far between. We did not yet have a chance to see Viva Riva, does it have something to do with Riva Kalimasi who makes the publicity for Skol and played in “La Vie est Belle’ (1985) by Mweze Ngangura et Benoît Lamy and starring Pappa Wemba. We liked that movie a lot.

KONONO: Where are you from?

BAIO: I was born in Manhattan and grew up north of New York City. I live in Greenpoint, Brooklyn now.

KONONO: Do you play music for pleasure? As a social service? For money?

BAIO: I’ve played music for pleasure since I was about nine years old. I’m lucky enough to be able to live off it now.

KONONO: How would you describe it in words?

BAIO: I’d describe the music of Vampire Weekend, the band I play in, as pop!

KONONO: Do you believe you are part of a musical movement?

BAIO: I think it’s a difficult thing to say. I leave those sorts of questions up to the journalists that write about music. That said, we’ve definitely made good friends with a ton of other great musicians over the years.

KONONO: How important are the lyrics? What do they say?

BAIO: I think the lyrics are very important to our music. My band mates Ezra & Rostam write them. They say a lot of things! Still, I think instrumental music, or music in a language I don’t know can be just as affecting.

KONONO: Is there an influence from African music? From Congolese music in particular? Which?

BAIO: Absolutely, our band is inspired by tons of music from Africa. One of our songs is called Cape Cod Kwassa Kwassa. The title is definitely inspired by Congolese music, even if the sound of the song isn’t necessarily.

KONONO: Have you ever been in Africa?

BAIO: No, but I hope to change that very soon.

KONONO: Did you ever play with African musicians?

BAIO: I’ve yet to do any collaborating outside our band, but I also hope to change that soon as well.

KONONO: What instruments do you play?

BAIO: I can play piano, guitar, bass and my laptop.

KONONO: Do you know how to repair them if they break?

BAIO: Depends on how badly they break.

KONONO: How did you learn to play music?

BAIO: I grew up playing a lot of instruments, some self-taught and some with lessons.

KONONO: Did you play with members of your family?

BAIO: Yes. I have a very vivid memory of playing “Bullet with Butterfly Wings” by The Smashing Pumpkins with my father when I was about 12 years old.

KONONO: Have you got any formal training?

BAIO: Yes. I took piano lessons for about nine years when I was growing up. Sometimes I’ll take a lesson from time to time just to see what else I can learn.

KONONO: Do you compose collectively or alone?

BAIO: Our band works in different ways. A lot of songs will start with an idea from Ezra & Rostam, and then we’ll flesh them out and arrange them as a band. Other times they’ll be built up in the studio. Rostam, who is the producer in our band, does a lot of work with computers. Lately I’ve been writing a lot of music on my computer alone. I’m not sure what’s going to end up with it but I’ve been enjoying it immensely.

KONONO: Do computers play a role in the way you compose?

BAIO: Absolutely.

Konono no1 photograph: Pieter Hugo

Posted 18.07.2011